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June 4, 2024
Bangkok Devaluation: A Few Things That Used to Matter…But Don’t Anymore [S7.E22]
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In a possible new series, Greg and Ed discuss things that have become less important or meaningful since they began living in Thailand. In short, stuff that we used to value a lot that just seems not to matter as much anymore. Ed begins with the...
In a possible new series, Greg and Ed discuss things that have become less important or meaningful since they began living in Thailand. In short, stuff that we used to value a lot that just seems not to matter as much anymore.
Ed begins with the somewhat obvious: clothes in general just matter a lot less. Never a fashion guy, Bangkok’s ‘uni-season’ is perfect for him since he can basically wear the same thing all year round. Greg - famous for his consistent shorts/t-shirt/vans outfit, concurs that it’s just much easier here to get dressed in the morning. No need for ‘winter clothes,’ giant snow boots, nor rainwear either - rains come and go so quickly, it’s simply better to wait them out.
Greg starts out with a much more complex topic: he thinks sex and perhaps even romance are given less significance in Thai culture, and it has rubbed off on him in the last twenty years. Many factors could be at play: Thais seemingly casual nature about just about everything, the advantage that foreigners seem to have in the Thai dating market, or perhaps the greater social acceptance of go-go bars and redlight districts. The guys do their best to delve into the nuances of the issue.
Ed responds by bringing up his total lack of interest in owning a car, something that would be unthinkable anywhere he lived in the U.S. Although Greg likes the freedom owning a car in Bangkok brings, Ed sees it as nothing but a hassle and is glad to be free of looking for parking spaces, paying for upkeep, and worrying how much he has had to drink.
Greg then brings up another tricky topic: intellectual property. Back home fake goods were a hard no-no, but their prevalence here has devalued the importance of buying original all the time, with the caveat that you know what you are getting when you buy.
Ed finishes off by admitting that he probably cares less about his salary living in Thailand than he would have if he stayed back home. Greg concurs that when the average salaries of nearly everyone else are much lower, it makes it much easier to be happy with what you are getting here, as long as you like your job.
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Transcript
Greg (00:00:00) - Sawat Dee Krap. And welcome to the Bangkok Podcast. My name is Greg Jorgensen, a Canadian who came to Bangkok in 2001 and who True Story never heard the song One Night in Bangkok until I'd already been here like five years. So I was really confused why everyone seemed to know that phrase.
Ed (00:00:16) - I didn't know that. How could you not know that song? That that was practically the only thing I knew about Thailand when I came here is that song.
Greg (00:00:24) - Well, we only in Canada. We only got electricity in 1980, so take it.
Ed (00:00:27) - A bit longer. Maybe that's it. And I'm an American who came to Thailand on a one year teaching contract 23 years ago, fell in love with adult women sporting hello Kitty merchandise. So I never left.
Greg (00:00:41) - Man. As someone who has worked in big corporate offices before, I. It's cute. This is man. It's cute. It's cute. It's not man. You see, he's a 32 year old woman walking around, you know, hugging a little like Lilo and Stitch doll.
Greg (00:00:55) - You're like, come on, what's going on here?
Ed (00:00:57) - I find it charming. All right, well, different strokes. All right. We want to give you a big thanks to all of our patrons who support the show. Patrons get every episode a day early, behind the scenes photos of our interviews, a heads up to send questions to upcoming guests, and access to our discord server to chat with me, Greg, and other listeners around the world. But best of all, patrons also get an unscripted, uncensored bonus episode every week where we riff on current events and Bangkok topics. On this week's bonus show, we chatted about another group of converts that I took to my temple, the Blues Bar. This time a bunch of Hollywood actors, Greg, visit to the Siam Society to hear a lecture on a Buddhist archaeological dig, as well as a new hobby of Japanese archery. As part of our earlier resolution to put ourselves out there in Bangkok to meet more people, and a quick overview of the new and shockingly progressive visa laws that will make Thailand easier for people around the world to visit and work in, which is definitely good for listeners of the Bangkok Podcast.
Ed (00:02:02) - Yeah, to learn how to become a patron and get all this good stuff. Plus full access to over 700 bonus and regular back episodes. Click the support button at the top of our website and.
Greg (00:02:15) - Going up by two every single week. How's that for sure? Yeah.
Ed (00:02:20) - In about a thousand years we'll be millionaires.
Greg (00:02:23) - I can't wait, right? As always, if you have a karma to show idea or just want to say hi, head to Bangkok podcast.com and click the little microphone button on the bottom right. Leave us a voicemail and we'll feature it on the show for sure. All righty then. On this episode, we want to talk about the concept of devaluation, the process in which things that you had previously valued or found quite special or unique lose their sheen, their aura, their pizzazz over time. Now, obviously, Ed and I are not economists, but I think anyone who has lived here for a long time probably stays because living in Bangkok or Thailand makes life generally better as a net positive, and it does make you appreciate certain things about home even more.
Greg (00:03:03) - But it's not all rainbows and lollipops all the time. Sometimes after living here for a number of years, you find the things you had previously valued or found special were no longer thus. And now you find them less interesting, less important, or even completely worthless. Now. And this topic was my idea. I think it's an interesting thought experiment. Not exactly sure how it's going to play out, but let's have the conversation. What do you think?
Ed (00:03:28) - Okay, sure. You know, I think there's a lot of different ways you could take this topic. I think there's some fairly obvious, maybe trivial things. So I'll just bring up something first. Just to be really obvious. Now, in the past, I never valued fashion or clothes. Very much shocking. Shocking being from northeastern Ohio. But man, I've noticed since I've been in Thailand, it's like since essentially there's one season, like the uni season I basically have now. I have, like casual clothes and slightly nicer clothes like that I teach in or whatever and.
Greg (00:04:05) - Put on my good t shirt.
Ed (00:04:06) - Yeah, I hardly ever, dude, I hardly have or have to put a suit on like in the States. It's like, obviously you've got your four seasons, which is a ton of clothes, but then I need to have like a jacket and tie and, you know, ready to go to a wedding or God forbid, a funeral. But man, it's like it's like clothes in Thailand are so much easier. I just, I feel like I'm much more likely to wear the same thing almost all year. And but to me, I like this. So I mean, I'm valuing clothes and fashion less, which totally suits my personality. Like I wish. I mean, in a way you're kind of a little bit the same. I mean, you you're quite famous for dressing in simple, repetitive terms.
Greg (00:04:53) - thanks. I guess I mean, that sounds negative, but I'm going to take it as a positive. You're right. I never thought about that, and I, I, I have.
Greg (00:04:59) - I have. The value of clothes has dropped for me too. Most of the time I wear a pair of shorts, a pair of vans and a black t shirt. It's simple. It's functional, it's easy. I don't write about it.
Ed (00:05:11) - That's the Greg, the Greg outfit. The Greg uniform.
Greg (00:05:14) - Yeah. Now, if I had a live, young, skinny body, I'd probably put a bit more effort into dressing. Probably a bit flashier than I do, but that's part of it. But yeah, it's it's you're always dressed for the weather here and.
Ed (00:05:29) - Yeah, I mean, it's just at least I mean, again, never into it, but now I'm lucky enough to I can be into it even less clothes, clothes, fashion. It just matters to me even less than before. Okay. So okay, so that's fairly trivial. You got some deeper thoughts. So give me one of your let me hear one of your your deep thoughts. What do you what do you value less now than you did before?
Greg (00:05:55) - One a really good one.
Greg (00:05:56) - The close one. Well, this is something that is probably. It's the big one. And and it was born out of something. Something that I wrote years ago. And I put this sentence together and I never put much thought into it. But I said that living in Thailand as a as a Western male. Devalues the currency of sex.
Ed (00:06:18) - Interesting.
Greg (00:06:19) - And it's kind of a deep thought. Now, deep, deep.
Ed (00:06:22) - Thoughts by Greg.
Greg (00:06:23) - Things that make you go. Now, huge caveat here. So I don't put my foot in my mouth too deeply. obviously this is coming from the perspective of a straight white man. So your mileage may vary. And I'm using a broad generalization that Western men find it quite easy to find romance here. if you want to learn more, check out season three, episode 64 and 65, where Ed and I sat down with four Western women to discuss that minefield, which was a very interesting conversation. but maybe it was where I grew up, which was quite conservative and straight laced, but no one I knew played the field too much.
Greg (00:07:00) - Relationships were usually committed and long term and like, stepping out of bounds, for some fun on the side was just a huge no no. Like, you just did not do that. And it sounds really cheesy, but it made the whole relationship love sex thing something special and something you would work at. And I think that living here, where those kind of things are seen as sort of much more party fun, fun, you go out, you meet someone, it's I think it's a lot less weight given to it. And I think after living here for a long time, you sort of tend to not place as much value on those things. My perspective.
Ed (00:07:40) - There's actually a lot of different ideas in there. I mean, there's the one thing, you know, we've talked about it before. We it's just it's just a simple truth that I think for most, I think I'm safe to say most white guys here just find it easier to find someone to date here than they do back home. Now, I know that's not true for everyone.
Ed (00:07:59) - I don't want to generalize. That is definitely not true for everyone. But it's such a cliche and we've, you know, again, we've done shows on it before where we talked about the different experience of, of, for wrong men versus, for wrong women. So there's that angle of what you're talking about. But what you're saying is something even deeper. So it's an interesting question. It almost like you're saying is that dating here is more superficial than it is back home. And in the end, you feel like you've you've kind of gone native a little bit. That's an interesting point.
Greg (00:08:31) - Well, there's an old cliche line, and this is something that one of our mutual friends, said to me one time and I thought was hilarious, and he's sort of a not tall kind of average height, average build guy. But he said back home, I'm just another ugly face in the crowd over here. I'm tall, dark and handsome, you know?
Ed (00:08:48) - Oh, right. And no, of course, no no no no no.
Ed (00:08:50) - Yes. No. Right. But but okay. But what but what you're saying is the result of that is that you value sex less.
Greg (00:09:01) - So yeah. And it's not specifically about sex. Like just.
Ed (00:09:05) - Just dating. So you mean just just dating? What you're saying back home was, like, such a big deal, but here, because it's, like, relatively easier. You value a less. It's less special. Something like.
Greg (00:09:18) - That. Yes. Yeah. I think that's a good way to put it in a roundabout kind of way. Let me give you one example. back home in Calgary, there was, you know, there was a couple of strip clubs. okay. And to go to a strip club, it was I rarely ever went to one. I almost knew no one who ever went to one regularly. they're kind of seedy. They're dark. The people in them are kind of shady and creepy. you know, there's the gold cliché of the angry woman marching around on stage or, you know, right.
Greg (00:09:51) - But, you know, you go out to a go go bar or what would be the equivalent of a stripper bar here. And it's fun, it's social, and it's you go and drink and party and meet people and the the vibe is totally different. So here I think it's just so much more common and so much more accepted and so much.
Ed (00:10:10) - interesting. I mean, I think it's true. Like when you say this, I can hear a ring of truth in it, but it's actually it's a nuanced issue, like here, here, here, there are these kind of red light areas that people know about. And then, yes, in those red light areas, you're going to get a different experience than you do back home. Right? Right. but again, you are talking about Calgary and of course, in, in the States, if you're in Vegas or Atlanta or New York, there's swanky strip joints, which is like the, you know, super party, you know, super cool places to be if you're into that kind of thing.
Ed (00:10:50) - You know, it's not all it's not all like deep, dark and depressing.
Greg (00:10:54) - You're right.
Ed (00:10:54) - You're right. You know what I mean?
Greg (00:10:55) - And I imagine there's guys in Calgary who have six pack abs and like, are super handsome and stuff and have no problem going out and getting all kinds of girls interested in them. and so this is a very subjective take on it, but I get it.
Ed (00:11:08) - You know, you're giving your experience. So I guess it makes sense. I mean, if, if something is just easier to experience over here. Then back home. Then in the long run, you're not going to think of it as so special and you're not going to value it as much, I guess.
Greg (00:11:20) - Yeah, let me just say that no one on the street in Calgary ever yelled out and called me a handsome man, so.
Ed (00:11:26) - Well, that's that's a shame. Let me just say that.
Greg (00:11:29) - Does their loss, man. My mom was right. It's their loss.
Ed (00:11:32) - That's no doubt about that.
Ed (00:11:34) - Well, my second point is, is also a little bit trivial or maybe kind of obvious, but you and I actually differ on this subject. I love the fact that in Bangkok, I don't own a car right now, I don't in the past, I haven't owned a car, but I don't like driving. And I love the fact that I can get around on the MRT. The BTS taxi motorbike. not owning a car for me is huge. And I. You know, I didn't grow up in the city. I grew up in the suburbs, obviously drove my whole life. I was in the States, you know, once I got my driver's license and I knew some people back home. I remember in law school, I met a girl who didn't have a driver's license and just said, like, you know, I don't like to drive or I'm scared to drive. And I thought it was so odd and so strange. I'm like, I remember just not understanding it, like, what's what's wrong with you? You don't drive.
Ed (00:12:26) - and then, but when I came here, I met someone from Manhattan who said he doesn't have a driver's license. And when I first got her, I'm like, I'll never be that way. You know? Like, his thing was like, hey, I'm a city person in, like, city people, you know, driving the traffic is too bad or it's too expensive. Interesting. and I remember thinking like, okay, that's not me. And then I totally became that person. Where now I love living in the middle of a city where I don't need to own a car, and not having a car is not any kind of disadvantage. And I don't have to worry about like, leases. I don't have to worry about maintenance, I don't have to buy gas. I don't have to. I don't have to worry about where to park. I don't have to worry about how much I drink at night. I'm I'm a huge no car guy. Like, I've just totally fallen in love with it.
Ed (00:13:15) - And it would be like if I, if I was back in the States and I had to. And I was back into living in the suburbs or wherever it would be a, it would be a big transition for me to go back to owning a car.
Greg (00:13:25) - Interesting. So, so the value of a car to you has dropped significantly. Yeah.
Ed (00:13:30) - Now, to me the value of a car has gone to zero. And in the States I was never a super car guy. I mean, I liked cars and you know, I had a semi sporty car at one point in my life. but it's just you have my whole life in the States. You have to. At least I interpreted as I have to have a car. Yeah. You know, it's just one of those things you you have to solve. I remember when I was working as a lawyer in Chicago, and I got a kind of temporary few month job downstate in Illinois. I was actually clerking for the Illinois Supreme Court to bring back a distant memories.
Ed (00:14:04) - And I'm like, shit. Like, what am I going to drive like? It was like a big it's like you, I can't live down there in the middle of Illinois without a car. You can't. You literally can't. And so it was like this big problem I had to solve.
Greg (00:14:17) - Interesting. It was the same for me growing up in, in, in Calgary, where I'm from, because it was in the prairies. And of course, there's just everything's so spread out. Of course you have to have you have you have to.
Ed (00:14:26) - Absolutely, absolutely. And, I get you and I've talked about this before, I understand there are advantages to driving in Bangkok, like, you know, control, basically. but, I don't know. For me, I'm, I'm surprisingly totally on the no car bandwagon. I love it. Cars are meaning cars are worth nothing to me.
Greg (00:14:47) - I got to say, I might be with you if I didn't have a family. Like I didn't have a kid.
Greg (00:14:51) - Because I see, and it's so cheap and easy to get a taxi or a grab like relative to speech for, you know, for, for for a lot of people here. Absolutely. having a kid changes in math somewhat, but yeah, it's there's so many options. And you have owning a car is just very easy to forget how much you used to value that.
Ed (00:15:10) - Yeah. Absolutely. Definitely. Yeah.
Greg (00:15:13) - Well, the next thing I wrote down is, is again, something that I think we've mentioned touched on on the show previously, but the concept of, intellectual property, has, has really dropped off the map for me. And, it's funny because years ago I went for a job interview at, a very big law firm here as someone who was going to be sort of maintaining the intellectual property library of this law firm. And I never didn't get the job. And I'm glad I didn't, because I really think I would have hated it. But this this came into my mind because I saw a story the other day.
Greg (00:15:48) - I think it was it was in Forbes or the Washington Post or South China morning post or something like these, one of these big magazine newspaper things. And it was about the, sort of subculture of fashion in Bangkok, in Thailand, about like you see a woman walking down the street and she's got, like, Louis Vuitton pajamas on or something.
Ed (00:16:08) - Oh, right. Right.
Greg (00:16:08) - And she and she's, like, selling chicken on the side of the road. Obviously it's not. It's not a genuine. Louis Vuitton thing. But it was all about this subculture of people that have taken these high. So brand and labels and icon and logos and turned them into their own like fashion thing here. Completely outside what's controlled.
Ed (00:16:28) - Right.
Greg (00:16:29) - And you know, and the big labels are like, oh, we don't we don't like this, we don't appreciate it. But what are you going to do, like sue a chicken seller on the side of the road, you know, so.
Ed (00:16:37) - What you're saying is you've become you've become more flexible about it since you've been here.
Ed (00:16:41) - Yeah.
Greg (00:16:42) - And I really don't I have a complicated idea of, of the value of intellectual property as someone who creates stuff like what I'm doing right now, but also someone who's just after years of living in Bangkok. And it started with me going to Penta Plaza and going to the pad pong night market and browsing the old ripped DVDs of imported movies and, you know, going to the markets in Hong Kong and finding like, rare Western movies and things like that. And anything here you can find counterfeit and as long as you know what you're buying is counterfeit. I really struggle to see. Like. The like. Why should I care if it's counterfeit or not? If I know I'm buying a counterfeit thing?
Ed (00:17:26) - So what you want to do is you want to rule out a case where people are getting deceived or burned. So if someone if someone is dumb enough to think they're buying a Rolex and they're not, obviously you don't support that.
Greg (00:17:38) - I support them laughing at them because, but, you know, and of course, when you get into things like medicine or like airplane seatbelts, you obviously want to be buying the real thing.
Greg (00:17:48) - And that's that's a different discussion. But generally speaking of everyday things, I don't really care if they're fake or real, you know, interesting.
Ed (00:17:58) - I mean, you probably would agree with me on this. I care so little about, fashion brands and names that I feel like I'm just outside of this discussion. You know, it's like, I, I just, I don't know anything about fashion brands or fashion labels and, and, I would so I, I'm not the kind of person who would just buy something because it was a good copy of X because I don't, I don't even know what X is or care about X, you know what I mean, right? Yeah.
Greg (00:18:29) - I'm I'm down with that too. And like I, I've got a friend recently just the other day he posted that he bought a genuine one of these high brand purses for his wife, and you would not believe how much he paid for it. And it just blows my mind that someone would place that much value on a little folded leather chunk of sewn fabric.
Ed (00:18:50) - Especially when there's probably a virtually identical copy for 10%.
Greg (00:18:54) - Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So? So living in Bangkok, I think over the years and having such easy access to these counterfeit things, it's really sort of switched my perception of what what intellectual property is worth to me.
Ed (00:19:08) - Interesting. That's another that is another nuanced issue. Yeah. Undoubtedly. Yeah. Let me throw this out there. And this is this is this is something that's almost difficult for me to admit, because I'm really not sure it's a good thing at all. It could be good. So in my better moments, I think, like, hey, this is this has been a good thing that I value this last, but I can't decide. and the short answer, the short point is that I think living here has made me just value money less, or the amount of money I make less when I think about it. And my very simple explanation for this is, you know, I make what I make right now. I teach at a Thai university, and I really think that had I stayed in the U.S., I would not have been happy with the salary I'm happy with now.
Ed (00:20:01) - And that's even factoring in cost of living and things like spending power. There's some effect that Thailand has had on me that, I maybe it's again, this could very well be a good thing. I'm not not I don't know, I go back and forth, but you know, I teach I teach liberal arts. And obviously teaching liberal arts is not about making money. And teaching liberal arts is not about making money. And I really enjoy it. So it's like, okay, I win, you know, I'm doing a job. I really enjoyed that. I think I'm good at, but then I just look at relatively like what I'm making and whatever, and I'm thinking like, shit, if I was back home, I don't think, I think I would have maybe done what I'm doing for a few years and, and just move to a higher paying job. So there's, there's some reason, there's some reason why I'm just willing to accept making less. But part of it, it might just be obviously everyone's making less here.
Ed (00:20:58) - You know, this is Thailand we've talked about many times. It's going to be tough to match the salary you make back home. You might be able to do it in more power to anyone who can. You win? but I don't know. It's like I just feel like. But it's a it's a good thing, you know? It's like I found my thing that I like, but I just really can't picture myself back home. Like staying. Staying where I'm at. Right? Well, the way the way I have here.
Greg (00:21:26) - There's that Western pressure of. And I got into my early years after I'd been here for a few years, and I would go back home and visit. People would be like, so when are you moving back in? Like getting on with your life, you know, getting kids and a picket fence and getting a real job. So, yeah, I'm wondering, like, do you think Bangkok has had that effect on you, or do you think that's just how things are going, you know, larger sort of culture, societal aspect?
Ed (00:21:49) - It could be something just unique to me and the job I ended up in and how much I like doing it.
Ed (00:21:55) - So it might not even have nothing to do per se with Thailand, but it is one of my experiences here. But part of it, I think, is, is just that average salaries are less here. So you just kind of you just kind of adjust your expectations. And, you know, especially if you stay here over time. Now, I know people who come here for a short time, they're expecting they might expect to make here exactly what they make back home. And so then they might. I like it. They're not going to stick around as my whole point, right? well.
Greg (00:22:23) - You know, I read about this. I follow this sort of topic. I find it quite interesting. And for instance, there's something that a lot of young people are doing in China now, which is freaking out. A lot of the older people in China, which is in Chinese, they call it lying flat. And.
Ed (00:22:37) - Oh, yeah, no, I've read about this. I don't know that much about it though, but essentially they're opting out of working.
Ed (00:22:43) - Is that right?
Greg (00:22:43) - Yeah. They're basically saying like, why am I busting my ass 60 hours a week to make some rich guy at the top a bit more money? So what they're doing is they're finding a job where they can make just enough to pay rent and buy food, and the rest of the time they're doing their hobbies, they're learning new things. They're doing. They're like a side business or something like that. Right? It's I think it's part of a bigger discussion that I'm also seeing more and more about recently, which is like, why are we so obsessed? And this is obviously through a Western lens, but why are we so obsessed with getting the promotion going more bigger, making more, getting a higher, higher responsibility, getting, you know, why can't we just be happy making enough to cover our expenses and enjoying ourselves and having good friends and just being.
Ed (00:23:30) - I agree that that's why. That's why my reaction, is my this fact that I feel like I've kind of devalued it.
Ed (00:23:39) - Right? It very well could be a good thing. I'm just being honest that I sometimes have doubts, like maybe, you know, maybe I've kind of settled or maybe I've lowered my standards. I don't know, I don't know how to explain it, but the bottom line is, I am actually happy, with what I'm doing. but I'm not totally sure that I should be happy. But I am so, so I just. I should just accept it, I guess.
Greg (00:24:02) - No. Well, if you're happy, man, I think, I mean, like you said, you win. Like, that's that's. Isn't that why we're here? What else are we here?
Ed (00:24:09) - But I want to love what I'm doing and be filthy rich at the same time. Dude.
Greg (00:24:13) - Oh, you want to be buried with your gold or something? Who cares? You're going to be dead anyways. Yeah, to be happy with you, I do, okay, I do.
Ed (00:24:18) - I want to be buried with my gold.
Greg (00:24:22) - Well, I think I think that was an interesting an interesting quick look at this. And, you know, I think we're going to do maybe a follow up show on this on things, a couple of things that Bangkok has made us appreciate more.
Ed (00:24:33) - Yeah. There's certain things that I value a lot more here than I would back home. So let's do a show on that.
Greg (00:24:38) - Yeah, it'll be like a yin yang a heads and tails kind of kind of show, but for sure, you know, like we said, living in Bangkok overall, I think is if you live here for a long time, you've got to be getting a net positive out of it. But it's it's not, rainbows and lollipops all the way through. Sometimes just you just stop caring about stuff as a symptom of living here for so long.
Ed (00:25:01) - So no doubt, no doubt.
Greg (00:25:03) - Good times. All right, let's do something we call. Would you rather one of us picks two contrasting situations tied to Thailand to debate and choose which one we'd prefer.
Greg (00:25:13) - As we get, I'm going to ask you something cool. So we're just talking about driving a little bit, but, assuming you were back in the driver's seat, so to speak. Maha. And, you were speeding in your car, would you prefer to get pulled over and have to deal with a speeding ticket from an American cop or a Thai cop? Now with the caveat. Interesting question. The Thai cops don't often chase you on. They're in police cars and pull you over. That doesn't really happen here, but assuming it did, assuming all things are equal, would you rather have that happen in the States or in Thailand?
Ed (00:25:47) - This is a very tricky question. you we've addressed some of these issues before, like so. For example, in my 23 years in Thailand, I've never paid any kind of bribe. even even a small one of 200 baht. and often I would not say always you can get out of tickets in Thailand by throwing some money out. There might be more than 200 baht.
Ed (00:26:11) - I don't know what the going rate is. but it does vary, depending on, I'm sure, the cop and what you did. And speeding, I guess a little more serious. so. So the bottom line is, I. I want to maintain my streak. I wouldn't want to pay a bribe. so. But still, I think even I still think in Thailand, getting caught for speeding would probably be cheaper to get out of like this. It relates to our cost of living thing and money. It's hard to be cheap. It'd probably be cheaper just to pay. And as long as I didn't have to worry, like, you know, if it was a more serious crime where you could potentially be deported for it. Well, then obviously I'd rather I don't want to be deported, but I don't think you'd be deported for a speeding ticket. no. So I think I probably would say Thailand just because, the whatever fine, I would have to pay would end up being less in the US, even.
Ed (00:27:10) - Again, if you factor in like, inflation or, or cost of living, it would just be cheaper here. Yeah. So I think I'm going to go with the with the Thai experience.
Greg (00:27:20) - Yeah I think you're right. Even if you just got the real fine and got like a receipt and stuff like that just to get it in the States, it's got to be like 150 bucks or something.
Ed (00:27:28) - Yeah, it's going to be some. It's going to be something crazy. So in Thai terms, that would be more like, you know, 4000 baht. And I don't think a speeding ticket here is that much. I don't even know what it is because I don't own a car. But you're right, it's I think, I feel like. Do Thai cops chase people down for speeding? I do know some people who've gotten speeding tickets in Thailand, but they told me it was automatic from from, like a camera on the highway.
Greg (00:27:54) - Yeah, I've gotten one. Not for speeding, but for doing an improper lane change.
Ed (00:00:16) - I didn't know that. How could you not know that song? That that was practically the only thing I knew about Thailand when I came here is that song.
Greg (00:00:24) - Well, we only in Canada. We only got electricity in 1980, so take it.
Ed (00:00:27) - A bit longer. Maybe that's it. And I'm an American who came to Thailand on a one year teaching contract 23 years ago, fell in love with adult women sporting hello Kitty merchandise. So I never left.
Greg (00:00:41) - Man. As someone who has worked in big corporate offices before, I. It's cute. This is man. It's cute. It's cute. It's not man. You see, he's a 32 year old woman walking around, you know, hugging a little like Lilo and Stitch doll.
Greg (00:00:55) - You're like, come on, what's going on here?
Ed (00:00:57) - I find it charming. All right, well, different strokes. All right. We want to give you a big thanks to all of our patrons who support the show. Patrons get every episode a day early, behind the scenes photos of our interviews, a heads up to send questions to upcoming guests, and access to our discord server to chat with me, Greg, and other listeners around the world. But best of all, patrons also get an unscripted, uncensored bonus episode every week where we riff on current events and Bangkok topics. On this week's bonus show, we chatted about another group of converts that I took to my temple, the Blues Bar. This time a bunch of Hollywood actors, Greg, visit to the Siam Society to hear a lecture on a Buddhist archaeological dig, as well as a new hobby of Japanese archery. As part of our earlier resolution to put ourselves out there in Bangkok to meet more people, and a quick overview of the new and shockingly progressive visa laws that will make Thailand easier for people around the world to visit and work in, which is definitely good for listeners of the Bangkok Podcast.
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Greg (00:02:15) - Going up by two every single week. How's that for sure? Yeah.
Ed (00:02:20) - In about a thousand years we'll be millionaires.
Greg (00:02:23) - I can't wait, right? As always, if you have a karma to show idea or just want to say hi, head to Bangkok podcast.com and click the little microphone button on the bottom right. Leave us a voicemail and we'll feature it on the show for sure. All righty then. On this episode, we want to talk about the concept of devaluation, the process in which things that you had previously valued or found quite special or unique lose their sheen, their aura, their pizzazz over time. Now, obviously, Ed and I are not economists, but I think anyone who has lived here for a long time probably stays because living in Bangkok or Thailand makes life generally better as a net positive, and it does make you appreciate certain things about home even more.
Greg (00:03:03) - But it's not all rainbows and lollipops all the time. Sometimes after living here for a number of years, you find the things you had previously valued or found special were no longer thus. And now you find them less interesting, less important, or even completely worthless. Now. And this topic was my idea. I think it's an interesting thought experiment. Not exactly sure how it's going to play out, but let's have the conversation. What do you think?
Ed (00:03:28) - Okay, sure. You know, I think there's a lot of different ways you could take this topic. I think there's some fairly obvious, maybe trivial things. So I'll just bring up something first. Just to be really obvious. Now, in the past, I never valued fashion or clothes. Very much shocking. Shocking being from northeastern Ohio. But man, I've noticed since I've been in Thailand, it's like since essentially there's one season, like the uni season I basically have now. I have, like casual clothes and slightly nicer clothes like that I teach in or whatever and.
Greg (00:04:05) - Put on my good t shirt.
Ed (00:04:06) - Yeah, I hardly ever, dude, I hardly have or have to put a suit on like in the States. It's like, obviously you've got your four seasons, which is a ton of clothes, but then I need to have like a jacket and tie and, you know, ready to go to a wedding or God forbid, a funeral. But man, it's like it's like clothes in Thailand are so much easier. I just, I feel like I'm much more likely to wear the same thing almost all year. And but to me, I like this. So I mean, I'm valuing clothes and fashion less, which totally suits my personality. Like I wish. I mean, in a way you're kind of a little bit the same. I mean, you you're quite famous for dressing in simple, repetitive terms.
Greg (00:04:53) - thanks. I guess I mean, that sounds negative, but I'm going to take it as a positive. You're right. I never thought about that, and I, I, I have.
Greg (00:04:59) - I have. The value of clothes has dropped for me too. Most of the time I wear a pair of shorts, a pair of vans and a black t shirt. It's simple. It's functional, it's easy. I don't write about it.
Ed (00:05:11) - That's the Greg, the Greg outfit. The Greg uniform.
Greg (00:05:14) - Yeah. Now, if I had a live, young, skinny body, I'd probably put a bit more effort into dressing. Probably a bit flashier than I do, but that's part of it. But yeah, it's it's you're always dressed for the weather here and.
Ed (00:05:29) - Yeah, I mean, it's just at least I mean, again, never into it, but now I'm lucky enough to I can be into it even less clothes, clothes, fashion. It just matters to me even less than before. Okay. So okay, so that's fairly trivial. You got some deeper thoughts. So give me one of your let me hear one of your your deep thoughts. What do you what do you value less now than you did before?
Greg (00:05:55) - One a really good one.
Greg (00:05:56) - The close one. Well, this is something that is probably. It's the big one. And and it was born out of something. Something that I wrote years ago. And I put this sentence together and I never put much thought into it. But I said that living in Thailand as a as a Western male. Devalues the currency of sex.
Ed (00:06:18) - Interesting.
Greg (00:06:19) - And it's kind of a deep thought. Now, deep, deep.
Ed (00:06:22) - Thoughts by Greg.
Greg (00:06:23) - Things that make you go. Now, huge caveat here. So I don't put my foot in my mouth too deeply. obviously this is coming from the perspective of a straight white man. So your mileage may vary. And I'm using a broad generalization that Western men find it quite easy to find romance here. if you want to learn more, check out season three, episode 64 and 65, where Ed and I sat down with four Western women to discuss that minefield, which was a very interesting conversation. but maybe it was where I grew up, which was quite conservative and straight laced, but no one I knew played the field too much.
Greg (00:07:00) - Relationships were usually committed and long term and like, stepping out of bounds, for some fun on the side was just a huge no no. Like, you just did not do that. And it sounds really cheesy, but it made the whole relationship love sex thing something special and something you would work at. And I think that living here, where those kind of things are seen as sort of much more party fun, fun, you go out, you meet someone, it's I think it's a lot less weight given to it. And I think after living here for a long time, you sort of tend to not place as much value on those things. My perspective.
Ed (00:07:40) - There's actually a lot of different ideas in there. I mean, there's the one thing, you know, we've talked about it before. We it's just it's just a simple truth that I think for most, I think I'm safe to say most white guys here just find it easier to find someone to date here than they do back home. Now, I know that's not true for everyone.
Ed (00:07:59) - I don't want to generalize. That is definitely not true for everyone. But it's such a cliche and we've, you know, again, we've done shows on it before where we talked about the different experience of, of, for wrong men versus, for wrong women. So there's that angle of what you're talking about. But what you're saying is something even deeper. So it's an interesting question. It almost like you're saying is that dating here is more superficial than it is back home. And in the end, you feel like you've you've kind of gone native a little bit. That's an interesting point.
Greg (00:08:31) - Well, there's an old cliche line, and this is something that one of our mutual friends, said to me one time and I thought was hilarious, and he's sort of a not tall kind of average height, average build guy. But he said back home, I'm just another ugly face in the crowd over here. I'm tall, dark and handsome, you know?
Ed (00:08:48) - Oh, right. And no, of course, no no no no no.
Ed (00:08:50) - Yes. No. Right. But but okay. But what but what you're saying is the result of that is that you value sex less.
Greg (00:09:01) - So yeah. And it's not specifically about sex. Like just.
Ed (00:09:05) - Just dating. So you mean just just dating? What you're saying back home was, like, such a big deal, but here, because it's, like, relatively easier. You value a less. It's less special. Something like.
Greg (00:09:18) - That. Yes. Yeah. I think that's a good way to put it in a roundabout kind of way. Let me give you one example. back home in Calgary, there was, you know, there was a couple of strip clubs. okay. And to go to a strip club, it was I rarely ever went to one. I almost knew no one who ever went to one regularly. they're kind of seedy. They're dark. The people in them are kind of shady and creepy. you know, there's the gold cliché of the angry woman marching around on stage or, you know, right.
Greg (00:09:51) - But, you know, you go out to a go go bar or what would be the equivalent of a stripper bar here. And it's fun, it's social, and it's you go and drink and party and meet people and the the vibe is totally different. So here I think it's just so much more common and so much more accepted and so much.
Ed (00:10:10) - interesting. I mean, I think it's true. Like when you say this, I can hear a ring of truth in it, but it's actually it's a nuanced issue, like here, here, here, there are these kind of red light areas that people know about. And then, yes, in those red light areas, you're going to get a different experience than you do back home. Right? Right. but again, you are talking about Calgary and of course, in, in the States, if you're in Vegas or Atlanta or New York, there's swanky strip joints, which is like the, you know, super party, you know, super cool places to be if you're into that kind of thing.
Ed (00:10:50) - You know, it's not all it's not all like deep, dark and depressing.
Greg (00:10:54) - You're right.
Ed (00:10:54) - You're right. You know what I mean?
Greg (00:10:55) - And I imagine there's guys in Calgary who have six pack abs and like, are super handsome and stuff and have no problem going out and getting all kinds of girls interested in them. and so this is a very subjective take on it, but I get it.
Ed (00:11:08) - You know, you're giving your experience. So I guess it makes sense. I mean, if, if something is just easier to experience over here. Then back home. Then in the long run, you're not going to think of it as so special and you're not going to value it as much, I guess.
Greg (00:11:20) - Yeah, let me just say that no one on the street in Calgary ever yelled out and called me a handsome man, so.
Ed (00:11:26) - Well, that's that's a shame. Let me just say that.
Greg (00:11:29) - Does their loss, man. My mom was right. It's their loss.
Ed (00:11:32) - That's no doubt about that.
Ed (00:11:34) - Well, my second point is, is also a little bit trivial or maybe kind of obvious, but you and I actually differ on this subject. I love the fact that in Bangkok, I don't own a car right now, I don't in the past, I haven't owned a car, but I don't like driving. And I love the fact that I can get around on the MRT. The BTS taxi motorbike. not owning a car for me is huge. And I. You know, I didn't grow up in the city. I grew up in the suburbs, obviously drove my whole life. I was in the States, you know, once I got my driver's license and I knew some people back home. I remember in law school, I met a girl who didn't have a driver's license and just said, like, you know, I don't like to drive or I'm scared to drive. And I thought it was so odd and so strange. I'm like, I remember just not understanding it, like, what's what's wrong with you? You don't drive.
Ed (00:12:26) - and then, but when I came here, I met someone from Manhattan who said he doesn't have a driver's license. And when I first got her, I'm like, I'll never be that way. You know? Like, his thing was like, hey, I'm a city person in, like, city people, you know, driving the traffic is too bad or it's too expensive. Interesting. and I remember thinking like, okay, that's not me. And then I totally became that person. Where now I love living in the middle of a city where I don't need to own a car, and not having a car is not any kind of disadvantage. And I don't have to worry about like, leases. I don't have to worry about maintenance, I don't have to buy gas. I don't have to. I don't have to worry about where to park. I don't have to worry about how much I drink at night. I'm I'm a huge no car guy. Like, I've just totally fallen in love with it.
Ed (00:13:15) - And it would be like if I, if I was back in the States and I had to. And I was back into living in the suburbs or wherever it would be a, it would be a big transition for me to go back to owning a car.
Greg (00:13:25) - Interesting. So, so the value of a car to you has dropped significantly. Yeah.
Ed (00:13:30) - Now, to me the value of a car has gone to zero. And in the States I was never a super car guy. I mean, I liked cars and you know, I had a semi sporty car at one point in my life. but it's just you have my whole life in the States. You have to. At least I interpreted as I have to have a car. Yeah. You know, it's just one of those things you you have to solve. I remember when I was working as a lawyer in Chicago, and I got a kind of temporary few month job downstate in Illinois. I was actually clerking for the Illinois Supreme Court to bring back a distant memories.
Ed (00:14:04) - And I'm like, shit. Like, what am I going to drive like? It was like a big it's like you, I can't live down there in the middle of Illinois without a car. You can't. You literally can't. And so it was like this big problem I had to solve.
Greg (00:14:17) - Interesting. It was the same for me growing up in, in, in Calgary, where I'm from, because it was in the prairies. And of course, there's just everything's so spread out. Of course you have to have you have you have to.
Ed (00:14:26) - Absolutely, absolutely. And, I get you and I've talked about this before, I understand there are advantages to driving in Bangkok, like, you know, control, basically. but, I don't know. For me, I'm, I'm surprisingly totally on the no car bandwagon. I love it. Cars are meaning cars are worth nothing to me.
Greg (00:14:47) - I got to say, I might be with you if I didn't have a family. Like I didn't have a kid.
Greg (00:14:51) - Because I see, and it's so cheap and easy to get a taxi or a grab like relative to speech for, you know, for, for for a lot of people here. Absolutely. having a kid changes in math somewhat, but yeah, it's there's so many options. And you have owning a car is just very easy to forget how much you used to value that.
Ed (00:15:10) - Yeah. Absolutely. Definitely. Yeah.
Greg (00:15:13) - Well, the next thing I wrote down is, is again, something that I think we've mentioned touched on on the show previously, but the concept of, intellectual property, has, has really dropped off the map for me. And, it's funny because years ago I went for a job interview at, a very big law firm here as someone who was going to be sort of maintaining the intellectual property library of this law firm. And I never didn't get the job. And I'm glad I didn't, because I really think I would have hated it. But this this came into my mind because I saw a story the other day.
Greg (00:15:48) - I think it was it was in Forbes or the Washington Post or South China morning post or something like these, one of these big magazine newspaper things. And it was about the, sort of subculture of fashion in Bangkok, in Thailand, about like you see a woman walking down the street and she's got, like, Louis Vuitton pajamas on or something.
Ed (00:16:08) - Oh, right. Right.
Greg (00:16:08) - And she and she's, like, selling chicken on the side of the road. Obviously it's not. It's not a genuine. Louis Vuitton thing. But it was all about this subculture of people that have taken these high. So brand and labels and icon and logos and turned them into their own like fashion thing here. Completely outside what's controlled.
Ed (00:16:28) - Right.
Greg (00:16:29) - And you know, and the big labels are like, oh, we don't we don't like this, we don't appreciate it. But what are you going to do, like sue a chicken seller on the side of the road, you know, so.
Ed (00:16:37) - What you're saying is you've become you've become more flexible about it since you've been here.
Ed (00:16:41) - Yeah.
Greg (00:16:42) - And I really don't I have a complicated idea of, of the value of intellectual property as someone who creates stuff like what I'm doing right now, but also someone who's just after years of living in Bangkok. And it started with me going to Penta Plaza and going to the pad pong night market and browsing the old ripped DVDs of imported movies and, you know, going to the markets in Hong Kong and finding like, rare Western movies and things like that. And anything here you can find counterfeit and as long as you know what you're buying is counterfeit. I really struggle to see. Like. The like. Why should I care if it's counterfeit or not? If I know I'm buying a counterfeit thing?
Ed (00:17:26) - So what you want to do is you want to rule out a case where people are getting deceived or burned. So if someone if someone is dumb enough to think they're buying a Rolex and they're not, obviously you don't support that.
Greg (00:17:38) - I support them laughing at them because, but, you know, and of course, when you get into things like medicine or like airplane seatbelts, you obviously want to be buying the real thing.
Greg (00:17:48) - And that's that's a different discussion. But generally speaking of everyday things, I don't really care if they're fake or real, you know, interesting.
Ed (00:17:58) - I mean, you probably would agree with me on this. I care so little about, fashion brands and names that I feel like I'm just outside of this discussion. You know, it's like, I, I just, I don't know anything about fashion brands or fashion labels and, and, I would so I, I'm not the kind of person who would just buy something because it was a good copy of X because I don't, I don't even know what X is or care about X, you know what I mean, right? Yeah.
Greg (00:18:29) - I'm I'm down with that too. And like I, I've got a friend recently just the other day he posted that he bought a genuine one of these high brand purses for his wife, and you would not believe how much he paid for it. And it just blows my mind that someone would place that much value on a little folded leather chunk of sewn fabric.
Ed (00:18:50) - Especially when there's probably a virtually identical copy for 10%.
Greg (00:18:54) - Yeah, exactly. Exactly. So? So living in Bangkok, I think over the years and having such easy access to these counterfeit things, it's really sort of switched my perception of what what intellectual property is worth to me.
Ed (00:19:08) - Interesting. That's another that is another nuanced issue. Yeah. Undoubtedly. Yeah. Let me throw this out there. And this is this is this is something that's almost difficult for me to admit, because I'm really not sure it's a good thing at all. It could be good. So in my better moments, I think, like, hey, this is this has been a good thing that I value this last, but I can't decide. and the short answer, the short point is that I think living here has made me just value money less, or the amount of money I make less when I think about it. And my very simple explanation for this is, you know, I make what I make right now. I teach at a Thai university, and I really think that had I stayed in the U.S., I would not have been happy with the salary I'm happy with now.
Ed (00:20:01) - And that's even factoring in cost of living and things like spending power. There's some effect that Thailand has had on me that, I maybe it's again, this could very well be a good thing. I'm not not I don't know, I go back and forth, but you know, I teach I teach liberal arts. And obviously teaching liberal arts is not about making money. And teaching liberal arts is not about making money. And I really enjoy it. So it's like, okay, I win, you know, I'm doing a job. I really enjoyed that. I think I'm good at, but then I just look at relatively like what I'm making and whatever, and I'm thinking like, shit, if I was back home, I don't think, I think I would have maybe done what I'm doing for a few years and, and just move to a higher paying job. So there's, there's some reason, there's some reason why I'm just willing to accept making less. But part of it, it might just be obviously everyone's making less here.
Ed (00:20:58) - You know, this is Thailand we've talked about many times. It's going to be tough to match the salary you make back home. You might be able to do it in more power to anyone who can. You win? but I don't know. It's like I just feel like. But it's a it's a good thing, you know? It's like I found my thing that I like, but I just really can't picture myself back home. Like staying. Staying where I'm at. Right? Well, the way the way I have here.
Greg (00:21:26) - There's that Western pressure of. And I got into my early years after I'd been here for a few years, and I would go back home and visit. People would be like, so when are you moving back in? Like getting on with your life, you know, getting kids and a picket fence and getting a real job. So, yeah, I'm wondering, like, do you think Bangkok has had that effect on you, or do you think that's just how things are going, you know, larger sort of culture, societal aspect?
Ed (00:21:49) - It could be something just unique to me and the job I ended up in and how much I like doing it.
Ed (00:21:55) - So it might not even have nothing to do per se with Thailand, but it is one of my experiences here. But part of it, I think, is, is just that average salaries are less here. So you just kind of you just kind of adjust your expectations. And, you know, especially if you stay here over time. Now, I know people who come here for a short time, they're expecting they might expect to make here exactly what they make back home. And so then they might. I like it. They're not going to stick around as my whole point, right? well.
Greg (00:22:23) - You know, I read about this. I follow this sort of topic. I find it quite interesting. And for instance, there's something that a lot of young people are doing in China now, which is freaking out. A lot of the older people in China, which is in Chinese, they call it lying flat. And.
Ed (00:22:37) - Oh, yeah, no, I've read about this. I don't know that much about it though, but essentially they're opting out of working.
Ed (00:22:43) - Is that right?
Greg (00:22:43) - Yeah. They're basically saying like, why am I busting my ass 60 hours a week to make some rich guy at the top a bit more money? So what they're doing is they're finding a job where they can make just enough to pay rent and buy food, and the rest of the time they're doing their hobbies, they're learning new things. They're doing. They're like a side business or something like that. Right? It's I think it's part of a bigger discussion that I'm also seeing more and more about recently, which is like, why are we so obsessed? And this is obviously through a Western lens, but why are we so obsessed with getting the promotion going more bigger, making more, getting a higher, higher responsibility, getting, you know, why can't we just be happy making enough to cover our expenses and enjoying ourselves and having good friends and just being.
Ed (00:23:30) - I agree that that's why. That's why my reaction, is my this fact that I feel like I've kind of devalued it.
Ed (00:23:39) - Right? It very well could be a good thing. I'm just being honest that I sometimes have doubts, like maybe, you know, maybe I've kind of settled or maybe I've lowered my standards. I don't know, I don't know how to explain it, but the bottom line is, I am actually happy, with what I'm doing. but I'm not totally sure that I should be happy. But I am so, so I just. I should just accept it, I guess.
Greg (00:24:02) - No. Well, if you're happy, man, I think, I mean, like you said, you win. Like, that's that's. Isn't that why we're here? What else are we here?
Ed (00:24:09) - But I want to love what I'm doing and be filthy rich at the same time. Dude.
Greg (00:24:13) - Oh, you want to be buried with your gold or something? Who cares? You're going to be dead anyways. Yeah, to be happy with you, I do, okay, I do.
Ed (00:24:18) - I want to be buried with my gold.
Greg (00:24:22) - Well, I think I think that was an interesting an interesting quick look at this. And, you know, I think we're going to do maybe a follow up show on this on things, a couple of things that Bangkok has made us appreciate more.
Ed (00:24:33) - Yeah. There's certain things that I value a lot more here than I would back home. So let's do a show on that.
Greg (00:24:38) - Yeah, it'll be like a yin yang a heads and tails kind of kind of show, but for sure, you know, like we said, living in Bangkok overall, I think is if you live here for a long time, you've got to be getting a net positive out of it. But it's it's not, rainbows and lollipops all the way through. Sometimes just you just stop caring about stuff as a symptom of living here for so long.
Ed (00:25:01) - So no doubt, no doubt.
Greg (00:25:03) - Good times. All right, let's do something we call. Would you rather one of us picks two contrasting situations tied to Thailand to debate and choose which one we'd prefer.
Greg (00:25:13) - As we get, I'm going to ask you something cool. So we're just talking about driving a little bit, but, assuming you were back in the driver's seat, so to speak. Maha. And, you were speeding in your car, would you prefer to get pulled over and have to deal with a speeding ticket from an American cop or a Thai cop? Now with the caveat. Interesting question. The Thai cops don't often chase you on. They're in police cars and pull you over. That doesn't really happen here, but assuming it did, assuming all things are equal, would you rather have that happen in the States or in Thailand?
Ed (00:25:47) - This is a very tricky question. you we've addressed some of these issues before, like so. For example, in my 23 years in Thailand, I've never paid any kind of bribe. even even a small one of 200 baht. and often I would not say always you can get out of tickets in Thailand by throwing some money out. There might be more than 200 baht.
Ed (00:26:11) - I don't know what the going rate is. but it does vary, depending on, I'm sure, the cop and what you did. And speeding, I guess a little more serious. so. So the bottom line is, I. I want to maintain my streak. I wouldn't want to pay a bribe. so. But still, I think even I still think in Thailand, getting caught for speeding would probably be cheaper to get out of like this. It relates to our cost of living thing and money. It's hard to be cheap. It'd probably be cheaper just to pay. And as long as I didn't have to worry, like, you know, if it was a more serious crime where you could potentially be deported for it. Well, then obviously I'd rather I don't want to be deported, but I don't think you'd be deported for a speeding ticket. no. So I think I probably would say Thailand just because, the whatever fine, I would have to pay would end up being less in the US, even.
Ed (00:27:10) - Again, if you factor in like, inflation or, or cost of living, it would just be cheaper here. Yeah. So I think I'm going to go with the with the Thai experience.
Greg (00:27:20) - Yeah I think you're right. Even if you just got the real fine and got like a receipt and stuff like that just to get it in the States, it's got to be like 150 bucks or something.
Ed (00:27:28) - Yeah, it's going to be some. It's going to be something crazy. So in Thai terms, that would be more like, you know, 4000 baht. And I don't think a speeding ticket here is that much. I don't even know what it is because I don't own a car. But you're right, it's I think, I feel like. Do Thai cops chase people down for speeding? I do know some people who've gotten speeding tickets in Thailand, but they told me it was automatic from from, like a camera on the highway.
Greg (00:27:54) - Yeah, I've gotten one. Not for speeding, but for doing an improper lane change.
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